tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post3040538381001286066..comments2024-02-12T15:15:51.364+02:00Comments on The Five Year Project: A to Z Challenge: LessonsMisha Gerrickhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06364173848456424521noreply@blogger.comBlogger45125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-80111240738051078182011-04-16T16:57:54.908+02:002011-04-16T16:57:54.908+02:00Yes, we're definitely not a culture who enjoys...Yes, we're definitely not a culture who enjoys the Aesop's kind of moralizing--we don't like to be told what to do. LOL I agree; don't hit the reader over the head with themes or points. That IS way annoying! A good caution when writing.Carol Riggshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14092209912983783974noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-57016972400442947702011-04-16T09:17:07.943+02:002011-04-16T09:17:07.943+02:00Hehehe Rebecca, I experience the Bible to be diffe...Hehehe Rebecca, I experience the Bible to be differently. The thing about it is that it's supposed to be about lessons, so that's ok for me. ;-)<br /><br />Good point JE, if the story is written in such a way that the characters illustrate a message, it's very different to trying to make me sit through a sermon.<br /><br />Loki, glad to hear you're intending to ponder it, although it wasn't really intended as a lesson. That would be beyond my tolerance for hypocrisy. ;-)<br /><br />Thanks Jack. I'm glad you like it. <br /><br />Great way to sum it up Nicole! Thanks! :-)<br /><br />Rekha I agree with you completely. <br /><br />Nahno hehehe I like blogs for the exact same reason. I have no problem with a message, as it still gives me the option whether I want to incorporate it into my beliefs/opinions/actions. <br /><br />Ruth, I feel you on this one. ^_^<br /><br />Jessica, I think you hit the nail on the head. Speaking with vs. talking to is the essence of why I hate lessons. Because they talk to me (usually down at me). <br /><br />Heeeehee Tony, for the adults, of course. Because I would hate taking my child to the cinema to watch a movie that I just didn't enjoy... I love those one liners. But then I am rather twisted. ;-P<br /><br />Thanks so much, Huntress! :-D<br /><br />Hehehe Steph, my second CS Lewis reference. ^_^ I agree, if there's a message to the story, I can adopt it if I want or I can acknowledge it and move on. Like you said, it should hardly even be noticed. But if I have to fight the moral, I'm noticing. I'm seeing the writer and that is another reason why I want to punch him/her when I read. <br /><br />MM, the Hunger Games is an example for what I meant too. She showed how war was a bad thing. AND DID SHE DO IT WELL... Point is, at no point does she have Katniss say: "WAR IS BAD. DON'T DO IT." Let alone repeating it until I got a headache. I also think that you might underestimate teenagers. I'm not long out of my teenage years, so I remember fondly all the lessons people tried to force onto me and how I nodded, smiled and went on to ignore everything they said. Unless I already knew they were right. In which case it's useless preaching to the choir anyway...<br /><br />JF that is so important. In fact, that is probably my number one rule when I write. Because I HAAAAAATE it when I read a book where my intelligence is underestimated. Another reason why I hate forced lessons. <br /><br />Caitlin I hate that too. Usually all I can think about is how much better the message would have been if it was handled differently.<br /><br />So true, Friday!<br /><br />Zoanna, I still think my point stands because: 1) One can put a message into a book without making it figurative and without passing judgement one way or the other. 2) What parents tell their children is not our business. It isn't our place to teach anything except how to THINK. If you tell people what to think, how will they learn that lesson? For example, we can teach them to think about how lying might hurt the person being lied to. Hopefully that will stop at least some of the lying. But if my work keeps screaming DON'T LIE YOU STUPID CHILD!!! I think we both know that child won't listen - even if only to prove a point. <br /> <br />I agree with you about Genesis. It's astoundingly well written. ^_^<br /><br />Thanks Kathee. You put my point across well. :-)<br /><br />Lee, that is a good way to see it. Message as a bonus after entertainment. <br /><br />Duncan, it stays annoying even when it comes from the character. Because my mind immediately snaps to that and thinks: Hey wait... that's not the character. That's an author using a moral as a blunt weapon.<br /><br />I agree with you Donna. I love having my thoughts provoked and challenged. It helps me to explore parts of me that I never saw before. But preaching does the complete opposite. It shuts me down on the idea completely. <br /><br />Hehehe Tony, nicely put. ^_^<br /><br />Hootie, I'm the same. For me that's the difference between lesson and message. <br /><br />Thanks so much, Charmalot!<br /><br />Erin I agree with you about Aesop. :-)Misha Gerrickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06364173848456424521noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-76277542694001934862011-04-16T04:28:51.662+02:002011-04-16T04:28:51.662+02:00I am So with you on this! Well, unless its a book...I am So with you on this! Well, unless its a book like "Lolita" or a book that is written so well that the lesson isn't thrown in your face; it's just part of the natural course of events. But yes, only Aesop is allowed to tell me the moral of the story.Erin Wallacehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14740698417495064304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-38866594427275454962011-04-16T04:23:43.932+02:002011-04-16T04:23:43.932+02:00Hi Misha! I wanted to give you a blog award. Pleas...Hi Misha! I wanted to give you a blog award. Please come by my site to see it! :) <br /><br />Have a great weekend!Jordan McMakinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14524307244794669492noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-51725577312167579872011-04-16T04:21:35.982+02:002011-04-16T04:21:35.982+02:00To me, it depends on how the lesson is being portr...To me, it depends on how the lesson is being portrayed. I don't want someone to just sit there and preach to me about something, but, will accept it in other less in your face ways.<br /><br />Thanks for stopping by my blog and following! Following you back!A Hootie Hoothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01263831963403593981noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-3777961468178177042011-04-15T18:40:42.278+02:002011-04-15T18:40:42.278+02:00You are right. First rule of writing, show don'...You are right. First rule of writing, show don't tell.Tony Van Helsinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08879258913766153068noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-86696986425404749462011-04-15T17:19:47.334+02:002011-04-15T17:19:47.334+02:00There's a difference between being preached to...There's a difference between being preached to and having some killer thought provoking philosphy thrown at you. I just finished reading the Hugo winning "Starship Troopers" by Robert Heinlein again, and he's definitely controversial with his political philosophy. But I like books that make me think. I don't have to agree, but I like when they make me step back and look differently at my position on an issue. "The Way of Kings" by Brandon Sanderson (epic fantasy) is incredible at it.Donna K. Weaverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17158114738303231773noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-71765933592384582162011-04-15T12:47:38.611+02:002011-04-15T12:47:38.611+02:00I think that if it's blatantly obvious that it...I think that if it's blatantly obvious that it's the author who is force-feeding his/her readres, it can become quite annoying, but when it comes from a character, there's no problem :)<br /><br /><a href="http://www.duncaninkuantan.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">Duncan In Kuantan</a>Duncan D. Horne - the Kuantan bloggerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12693187639452569397noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-77134757512975025712011-04-15T07:12:20.405+02:002011-04-15T07:12:20.405+02:00I agree with what you say. I think that all books...I agree with what you say. I think that all books have some kind of message but it shouldn't hit us over the head. Instead the message should quietly enter our mind and converse with us and leave us options to make up our own mind. Entertainment in literature should be the priority. The message should be the bonus that we can accept or reject or for that matter never even notice.<br /><br /><br />Lee<br /><a href="http://tossingitout.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">Tossing It Out</a>Arlee Birdhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11663942782929929334noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-62755000448019430652011-04-15T04:29:36.363+02:002011-04-15T04:29:36.363+02:00I've seen this in writing books before - never...I've seen this in writing books before - never to preach at your readers. Be subtle and let them figure out the "lesson" if there is one...on their own. Thanks for the follow - your blog is great!<br /><br />www.quillorpill.blogspot.comKatheeJantzihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10415787292251646373noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-60747624799599262732011-04-15T04:15:16.489+02:002011-04-15T04:15:16.489+02:00Thought-provoking post and comments here. I appre...Thought-provoking post and comments here. I appreciate those who point out that some children's or YA fiction needs a bit more forthrightness of the moral because 1) some people don't think figuratively at that age and 2) some parents aren't doing the job of telling the kids right from wrong. (Morality doesn't come naturally. AFter all, do you have to teach a kid how to lie?)<br /><br />As for the Bible, there is not a better written book in the world. For plot, character, diaologue, theme, and anything else you want to study, read Genesis. I've not found anything comparable.Zoannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07119513647613843627noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-24058313632867566512011-04-15T04:04:06.125+02:002011-04-15T04:04:06.125+02:00Excellent post! I think writers should raise quest...Excellent post! I think writers should raise questions, not give answers.Tatum Flynnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00074228011847976820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-19251526616840936872011-04-15T02:23:13.705+02:002011-04-15T02:23:13.705+02:00I wholeheartedly agree with you. I loathe being pr...I wholeheartedly agree with you. I loathe being preached to, particularly when I'm attempting to enjoy a book. I don't even like my daughter to have books that blatantly teach a lesson. I was given a book for her titled "Hands are Not for Hitting". I quickly passed that on to someone else.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12146136846875431598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-40949820369900228482011-04-15T01:14:03.886+02:002011-04-15T01:14:03.886+02:00new to your blog. And thanks for following mine. A...new to your blog. And thanks for following mine. Agree: trust the reader, whatever the age. "Goodnight Moon" didn't tell my son [when he was so little, sigh] "feel safe." It just made him feel safe. I believe in: trust thy reader. JFJFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05163744586139509536noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-36706903509774633732011-04-15T00:52:55.683+02:002011-04-15T00:52:55.683+02:00Well, I chose a good day to visit a new blog ---
B...Well, I chose a good day to visit a new blog ---<br />Being an English teacher of young adults for a long time, I can guess why you see so many lessons that are beat over your head in YA books. The books are for young teenagers. Trust me, if the writer didn't express the lesson over and over, the young reader wouldn't get it. <br />Maybe I generalize a bit, but not much. <br />Look at Mockingjay, the third book of the Hunger Games Trilogy. If the reader doesn't get that war is bad by the end of the book, I don't know what to tell you. I did feel preached at a bit, but I had to realize that Collins didn't write the book for a 55 year-old adult. She wrote it for 15 year-old teenager. <br />The same with animated movies -- for kids. Kids don't have the brain power yet to think figuratively, so the lesson has to be stated or they won't get it at all.<br />You have to remember that children don't have their principles sorted out yet. Hence, their movies and books have lessons. <br /><br />I hope that I have given you the other side of the coin. You still might not like the messages, but now you know why they are there.<br /><br />MM the Queen of English<br />queenofenglish.wordpress.comAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-56352969986795521052011-04-15T00:28:32.608+02:002011-04-15T00:28:32.608+02:00Eff to the freaking yes!
Down with preaching. If ...Eff to the freaking yes!<br /><br />Down with preaching. If a book is written well enough you'll pick up a lesson without feeling like you're being taught it and might not even be a lesson the author is aware of. Like how C.S. Lewis taught me not to close the closest all the way when I go hunting for the other shoe.Steph Schmidthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00975939582442193113noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-91175379679450232562011-04-14T23:31:15.496+02:002011-04-14T23:31:15.496+02:00Ex Cell Lent POST...LOL.
To the authors who like ...Ex Cell Lent POST...LOL.<br /><br />To the authors who like to preach instead of entertain, I say, Shut up and Sing.<br /><br />Great blog :)Huntresshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08155372788872245758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-46575455505262008732011-04-14T23:13:32.285+02:002011-04-14T23:13:32.285+02:00What I really don't like in the animated movie...What I really don't like in the animated movies is the adult oriented one liners that the kids are not supposed to understand, so why put them in.Tony Paynehttp://www.delovesto.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-50633129826717950372011-04-14T22:15:58.691+02:002011-04-14T22:15:58.691+02:00I don't like to be bashed against the head, ei...I don't like to be bashed against the head, either. I have no problem with a book that has an opinion, but I think it should be subtle. The books I really enjoy are the ones that make me THINK. That present something to me in a way that gets my brain churning and I can see something in a new light because of how the book SPOKE to me, not because of what it TOLD me.<br /><br />And sometimes, I just want a book to entertain. To help me escape from the world.Jessica Ann Hillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14131293013101275074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-19500148440288801522011-04-14T21:57:55.724+02:002011-04-14T21:57:55.724+02:00I read books for entertainment unless it is a cook...I read books for entertainment unless it is a cookbook or medical book and I am trying to learn something.Ruthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15051904118383493849noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-48764723298668116972011-04-14T21:52:24.664+02:002011-04-14T21:52:24.664+02:00A book is more of entertainment and needs closure ...A book is more of entertainment and needs closure most of the times as well, but what about short stories and poems. They pretty much always contain some sort of meaning or message and as the reader you either agree or disagree.<br /><br />I like blogs because this way you can actually argue with the writers. ^^<br /><a href="http://nahnomclein.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow"><i> Nahno ∗ McLein</i> ™</a>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16548562702122142828noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-68301959604379468172011-04-14T21:43:32.253+02:002011-04-14T21:43:32.253+02:00As long as the message is weaved into
the story, ...As long as the message is weaved into <br />the story, its fine like most of our fairytales and mythology come with a set of moral lessons. No harm in that but pushing your sense of morality or ideals makes a book that less interesting...But I feel most of us are capable of making our own informed decisions, even when younger including avoiding such books in the future.Rek Seshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13484322426994645221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-68787551309871924052011-04-14T21:37:08.324+02:002011-04-14T21:37:08.324+02:00You can invite people TO think. But you can not te...You can invite people TO think. But you can not tell them WHAT to think. Excellent post.Nicole Amslerhttp://www.nicoleamsler.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-26601178599565475742011-04-14T21:18:16.085+02:002011-04-14T21:18:16.085+02:00I agree completely. Thanks for the interesting pos...I agree completely. Thanks for the interesting post.Jack Edwards Poetryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11813177533690643652noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5190412120537448720.post-31754636632743172862011-04-14T20:27:03.792+02:002011-04-14T20:27:03.792+02:00hmmmm... interesting lesson to think on. :)hmmmm... interesting lesson to think on. :)Loki Morganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07707069777843048067noreply@blogger.com